From Owning a Law Firm to Joyful 3-Hour Workdays - Attorney Ron Drescher
Attorney Ron Drescher shares his journey from big firm life to joyful 3-hour workdays on Your Practice Mastered with hosts Richard James and MPS. After years at a larger firm, Ron now runs a small bankruptcy law practice out of his living room. He explains how he found meaning, joy, and work-life balance by focusing on his priorities. Ron also discusses his new training programs helping other lawyers and staff learn bankruptcy law.
Tune in to hear Ron's insights on crafting a fulfilling small firm lifestyle practice.
Transcript
Okay, but be prepared for the cost of that. The life cost of that, not just the financial cost of that. And that then plays back into what do you want? How much does it cost? Can you be happy with wanting things that you can afford? And that all funnels back into gratefulness.
MPS: Hey, law firm owners, welcome to the Your Practice Master Podcast. your host. I'm MPS.
Richard James: And I'm Richard James
And, Michael. Today, I'm excited because maybe I shouldn't be so excited because I think he can now beat me on the golf course. Cause he's playing more golf than I am anymore. This is a man that I consider a friend. He's a past member of our world and he's now gone to build yet another business.
And I can't wait to hear all about his journey. Ron Drescher. Great to have you on today.
excited to be here with you.[:Richard James: So, how many days are you
MPS: Well, we're honored
Richard James: playing golf, by the way?
Atty. Ron Drescher: I am playing golf three days a week. I play on Thursdays, with a senior league of guys who are over the age of 61, I'm 64 now. I play on Friday afternoons with a guy who's another lawyer that I met on a bankruptcy case. And we also play on Sunday mornings. He is the one guy I know who's more of a golf lunatic than me.
Richard James: Now is your handicap coming down?
Atty. Ron Drescher: My handicap's at 11 right now. And sometimes I'm that good.
Richard James: Nice. Yeah. Sometimes you're that guy that they go, you're not an 11, there's no way you're an 11, you're a sandbagger 'cause you're playing too good. Someday you're gonna come down to North Carolina, we're gonna play together and I bet you're gonna be an 11. You're gonna play like a six.
And that's what's going on.
at, your mouth to God's ears.[:MPS: True. That, true that. Ron, you know what? Obviously we've got the opportunity to have known you over time, but for everyone that's listening, what's maybe something that not everyone knows about you?
Atty. Ron Drescher: I have a rating system for fried chicken. Five stars, four stars, three stars, two stars, one star. Alright, not everybody knows that about me. In fact, I put that on my website. And that I'm a fried chicken fanatic. And I signed up for Next Chapter and I've done a lot of work with Next Chapter, a bankruptcy software package.
And they sent me a candle with a fried chicken aroma to it. That's something that people don't really know about me.
MPS: I got to ask, I got to ask, what has achieved a five on your scale? Do you have one big one that's achieved the five?
Ron Drescher: There used to [:I was in my twenties it was a good thing to do on the way back from the airport.
MPS: I love that.
Richard James: Michael. Where would the best fried chicken be here? I don't even know. There was one that we had and it closed. Cause I don't know. It was next to that ice cream shop
MPS: Prices, chicken coop. Yeah. Prices, chicken coop.
Richard James: What was it called?
MPS: Prices, chicken coop. Yeah, that's a good. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know. I'd have to retest it I got you know, good wing spots, but fried chicken, I don't, a that's a tough one We'd have to go hammer the market again, which I'm happy to do.
Richard James: I'm now on a [:Atty. Ron Drescher: It's a worthy mission. It is a worthy mission.
Richard James: It's a worthy mission. It's not probably very good for our cardiovascular system, but it's a worthy mission.
MPS: True. Ron, so look I'm excited to learn a little bit more about this but for everyone listening Broad strokes. Why don't you talk a little bit about your journey as an entrepreneurial attorney?
Atty. Ron Drescher: You know what? I'm going to pick it up from the time I left the Richard James program. Alright? Because that was a turning point in my life. It opened my eyes to a whole bunch of ways. And it helped me really understand that there was nothing more important in life than knowing what you want.
t on a deeper level. Richard [:And when I first heard that, I thought I'm not going to stay small and keep it all. Because I felt that there was a bias against that approach. But then I came to learn that there was no bias, and that's a legitimate approach. That's the approach that ultimately I chose for my practice.
I went from having seven people working for me in my office to now it's just me. I have an assistant. I have a paralegal service that I work with and I work about three hours a day on my practice.
we have a high speed scanner [:Even though we're so paperless nowadays, but it's a high speed scanner copier. I've got one in my living room. So it's a legit law. So at one point, you call.
Richard James: Can I can I stop you from you? Can you go there?
Atty. Ron Drescher: Absolutely.
Richard James: Why? Why? So why? What is it in your mind that allowed? Because so so remember, there's an attorney listening to this right now that thinks that they're supposed to grow their law firm big. That's what they're supposed to do. That's what's expected of them that they can't see past the opportunity of keeping it small, keeping it all.
ifestyle law firm that gives [:What helped you cross that chasm in your brain?
Atty. Ron Drescher: Believe it or not, it was my resistance to replacing myself in the consult room, which was a thing that you and I have talked about repeatedly over the years. And, whenever I have a feeling about a thing or a resistance to it, I want to understand why I have that resistance so that either I can overcome it or lean into it.
I'm going to lean into that. [:I'm up to 400 or 500 an hour, which is a little mind boggling when you think about it. But the truth is when I tell people, yeah, my hourly rate's 400 an hour. Listen, if I work three hours a day, if I could bill and collect all three hours, and I'm gonna work four days a week, what is that? That's, I don't know, what's the math?
That's 5, 000 a week.
Richard James: Plenty.
Atty. Ron Drescher: So I can live on 5, 000 a week and even after my expenses knock that down to 3, 000 a week, I can live on 3, 000 a week. I can live pretty well on 3, 000 a week. I don't need more than that. And so, I'm a big believer in self knowledge, know yourself, know what's important to you and lean into that.
d your program, that was one [:What do I want today? I took up the guitar recently March 19th I picked up the guitar for the first time every morning. I Have a uniform. I have a guitar playing uniform. I wear my sweats. I wear my checkmate sweatshirt, because I'm a chess player also. I have slippers that are golf slippers.
I make a cup of coffee, I sit in the room, and I play guitar for about an hour to an hour and 15 minutes every morning, and I love it. It makes me happy. And what's my goal? My goal is someday to be able to meet other guitar players other musicians and be able to comfortably play with them.
Eric Clapton's got [:Richard James: Do you remember Mike Chastain?
Atty. Ron Drescher: Of course I follow him on social media when I'm on social media.
Richard James: Okay. So Mike Chastain, we interviewed Mike Chastain and he much like you has transitioned out of his primary law firm as being the primary thing that takes up his time. And his focus is music. And so, there must be something about this. I have always believed that attorneys have this real natural creative side to them.
And so it doesn't shock me that music you at one point, and maybe you still are, we're a script writer, if I remember. And so you have a very creative streak too, if I remember correctly. If I'm not mistaken, your son is in either was in movie editing or editing of some sort, if I'm not mistaken, and so it's in that same vein.
Atty. Ron Drescher: My son is the therapy gecko.
Richard James: Your son is the therapy.
Atty. Ron Drescher: He's the [:I'm in awe of my son. And what better thing can a dad say than he's in awe of his son? I'm also in awe of my daughter, because she's amazing too. But my son has done something remarkable, and I am in awe of him. And I feel tremendous success in my life because I have that feeling about my child.
Richard James: Is this, am I, is this him?
Atty. Ron Drescher: That's him. Yep. Therapy Gecko.
Richard James: Oh, it's great.
Atty. Ron Drescher: It's remarkable.
MPS: That's awesome.
Richard James: Yeah.
Atty. Ron Drescher: Yeah, it is.
MPS: [:Atty. Ron Drescher: Yeah.
Richard James: I, sorry I've completely derailed us. I've completely derailed us, Michael. And I took you off your journey, Ron. So I want to let you get back to your journey and your story about what's picked up from there. So let me pick it up back from where you left off about how you got your firm to be, keep it small, keep it all.
Atty. Ron Drescher: So COVID hit. And, we were all sitting around. I was playing a ton of chess online. And I started getting calls from other lawyers because everybody thought that bankruptcy was going to be the next hot, big practice area. Of course, in retrospect, we know it didn't happen that way.
going to create that course [:So I created a video course called Complete Bankruptcy, that has substantive bankruptcy law, that has systems, that has marketing, that has forms, that has a mastermind. I lead a mastermind twice a month, and it's for rising bankruptcy lawyers. It's not, look, I'm not going to train like top level bankruptcy lawyers.
They don't need me. They know what they're doing already, people just out of law school or people just out on their own or you've got a law firm. That hires young lawyers, who aren't bankruptcy lawyers. Those are the lawyers that I want to work with.
r twice a month since June of:I do these masterminds twice a month. I record them all. I put them on it's behind a paywall but I put them on this course and and I spoke at an event called Bankruptcy Week that was hosted by Next Chapter and I ended up with 500 leads and a hundred lawyers signed up.
And then, of course, it dwindled down because bankruptcy didn't become the practice area it was supposed to become. But about a year or so ago, I started thinking, you know what, bankruptcy is going to come back. And, I could take the core of my program and make it a little bit more non lawyer friendly.
gram called Team Accelerator [:But I've had a lot of law firms, sign up for their staff and their team members and gone through the program. And I'm getting good feedback from it. And you gave me some good feedback before we started. That's exciting for me to hear look, I've got 135 people taking these courses now.
Richard James: That's awesome.
MPS: Perfect.
Atty. Ron Drescher: And it's awesome. And we're just starting to launch a big marketing push over the next couple of months because bankruptcy is coming back some day bankruptcy is coming back. And so more people are going to be into it. More people who are bankruptcy lawyers are going to lean into it.
tcy lawyer, and I'm going to [:Richard James: So it's so born out of necessity, right? To a certain extent COVID like happened in a lot of areas and looked at opportunity ended up not being what it was. But nonetheless made a bunch of sales now pivoted and said, Hey, there's more to this than meets the eye. If it worked for this, it could work for that.
And now pivoted over to this next chapter and helping law firms understand how to train their team members. My question for you is. So now we've got the law firm that, you serve your clients and you work a lot with creditors, mainly still. Is that right? You work with debtors too? Or what side of the practice are you working on now?
Atty. Ron Drescher: You [:Richard James: So you got your three hours a day in that. And then you've got your, however many hours you're dedicating to the new launch and your existing mastermind members. What's what is it like? I guess the one question I would ask you for the person that's listening, right? Maybe they to have a great idea about their practice area.
And they've always thought about being a teacher of the practice area to other lawyers or non attorneys, staff, whatever in their particular field, whatever it is. Or maybe they've got some idea about the practice of law and whatever aspect and they're thinking maybe it's got value to somebody and they want to go out there and do it.
A lot of those people were born during the covert era. And so how do you balance both? Like how do you prioritize, how do you balance both? Is one just a more of a passion that you have more passion towards one and the other? Do you just treat them equal? Like, how do you manage both things in your life?
Atty. Ron Drescher: [:Richard James: A full joke because I do what my wife tells me to do.
Atty. Ron Drescher: You know something? There have been a few times I wanted to quit from complete bankruptcy. During the very slow days of the bankruptcy world. And I had about 11 people in the mastermind. And it's up since then, and I had two people showing up at my sessions.
And I was depressed about that. And my wife said, you know what? Gyms don't close just because people aren't showing up. People are still paying you. And then we made the decision as a family, the two of us, to lean into this. Yeah so I was half joking, but I talk about everything with my wife, because I'm a big believer in teams, team concept.
is, always focus on what you [:And if you recognize what you want, you need to prioritize that. Don't prioritize what other people want. Because then you're, first of all, you're not, you're doing something you don't want.
You're not doing what you do want. All right. And that's a recipe for unhappiness. So always try to focus on what you want to do and prioritize that. Cause that way, you've done what you wanted to do that day.
t you wanted to get clear on [:Atty. Ron Drescher: Something, it's not an easy thing. It's a very hard thing. And, here's what commitment is. Commitment is not only saying yes to one thing. But it's saying no to everything else and that's really scary you know because you know We want to live a rich full exciting life and we see all of these different opportunities these bright shiny objects we want to grab them, but Commitment is the key.
Without commitment there is no success and frankly, I believe that with commitment, you will eventually find success. May not always be in the format that you think it's going to be but that's why, that's, I've used the phrase leaning in several times during this call, because that's what commitment is all about.
o to everything else, but do [:MPS: Yeah I think that's great. I also think, part of finding what you want is understanding what you don't want, right? So knowing what you don't want, and I think that can help in the pursuit of figuring out what ultimately it is that you do, which I think is great advice.
Atty. Ron Drescher: I think there's a lot of truth to that, but you don't want to look too hard at what you don't want, right? You want to recognize that you don't want it and then leave it behind and move forward.
MPS: Agreed. I think you're spot on with that. I'm curious because you had mentioned that commitment breeds success or will eventually lead in some form to success depending on the format. Speaking of success, what are some of the things that Ron you do on a daily basis now that help contribute to your continued and sustained success?
r: First of all, I do what I [:And every day that you don't sell that building and take the cash and use it for something else, you're investing in that building. So I look at that, I think wait a second, I'm reinvesting in my life every day. So I need to make sure that I'm investing in the things that are important to me and that are valuable to me.
stantly thinking about, what [:And you do, you change, you grow, you refocus things come across you. Look, a person who might be your very best friend is, might be in another country doing something completely different. You're not going to meet them for five years. But in five years, your paths are gonna cross, that person's gonna become your very best friend for the rest of your life.
You don't even know that now, alright? So be open to different opportunities that are gonna come your way, that are gonna cause you to re explore and re examine your priorities and what's important. I could talk for a long time about this kind of stuff, because it's critical. Understanding yourself and self examination is critical.
mething that you turn to, or [:Atty. Ron Drescher: Right now, my, most of my self education is spent learning the guitar. So I watch videos, and I listen, and in fact, I don't know if you can see this. Can you see I have this callus here, this callus, and I've got calluses...
Richard James: yeah.
Atty. Ron Drescher: here on my fingers that those are guitar calluses.
All right. So what am I doing? I'm learning, guitar skills. And what else, what am I supposed to be doing? I'm not learning so much golf skills. And I'm not learning so much books. I do nonfiction. But right now I'm focused on the guitar. Because it brings me joy.
ife is about joy. All right. [:The planet that we live on offers us infinite opportunities to obtain joy. And it is our journey to find and discover the joy that is available in life. And that's one of the great gifts of the world, joy.
Richard James: Michael, I don't know about you, but it feels to me like I can clearly tell that Ron is filled with joy and enjoying himself on a daily basis.
MPS: I think it's fantastic.
Atty. Ron Drescher: And that's the thing, look, I'm 64 years old and, in 16 years I can run for president. Some young guy.
Richard James: Yeah, you're.[:MPS: Yeah. Yeah, absolutely, you are. Heh. Absolutely, you are. Ron, I'm gonna ask you because I'm curious there might be something outside of it and I feel like we've got a pretty good picture of what's got you excited but is there anything that's got you fired up and excited today?
Atty. Ron Drescher: Don't devalue the daily pleasures. They're critical because I love these time travel movies, right? Because there's a concept that time is this linear thing, and time is just a series of moments that are occurring as we proceed through life. So there are things that give you pleasure in life.
ries of wonderful moments in [:But you've caught me on a philosophical afternoon.
Richard James: No. That's what happens when you're sitting at the golf course. But besides the point, I would tell you that your answer to the question that you didn't necessarily ask is yes, absolutely. What your message is in direct line with the goal of our podcast, because the goal of our podcast is to inspire.
Provide hope and a glimpse for another law firm owner like you who's going through something Like or dislike what you're going through and here's what you have to say And you unlock something in them that they didn't realize previously existed And you give them that aha moment and they can take this and build from it.
And so that's what [:Oh, the systems that ran my business and the people that ran my systems and the numbers we have to measure and how we got there and how we tested and all those things are great. And they're very tactical approaches to running a business. But what you delivered today was a message that was. Look, let's get really clear on what you do want.
this joy and let's try to be [:You use the word that so few people use. Let's be present in today into this moment. And if we could all learn to do that, life would be so much better for everybody. Wars would go away. Strife would go away. Joy would go through the roof because we would all learn to be present. And it's hard.
It's not easy. It takes purposeful attraction to it and purposeful willingness to say no to everything else that's a distraction away from it. And I gotta be honest, I didn't know that's where this conversation was going to go today. But I gotta say thank you. I gotta say I appreciate you.
t I've always believed in is [:All right. And I was living in Los Angeles in my twenties and I saw how incredibly expensive it was to live there. And one of the reasons I moved to Baltimore is I wanted to be able to have a nice lifestyle without having to have a tremendous amount of money. And look, I'm all in favor of having a tremendous amount of money, but a lot of the decisions that you're going to make are going to be driven by what makes you happy and if what makes you happy is very expensive.
cost? Can you be happy with [:Richard James: Awesome. We could just chunk that section out right there, Michael, and it could be a lesson.
MPS: Yeah. Oh, is so good. Ron really appreciate the different perspective on here today. It is refreshing to hear, just a new perspective on things, which is excellent, but we appreciate you taking the time to be on today. And to all the law firm owners listening. If you enjoyed today, which man, there was a lot to enjoy.
Make sure to hit that like button, hit that subscribe or follow button, depending on where you're watching or listening, turn those bell notifications on, and then just show Ron some love down in the comments below. Let us know your thoughts, just even a job well done by Ron. But again, Ron, we appreciate it.
Atty. Ron Drescher: My pleasure.
ber of people watch this but [:Atty. Ron Drescher: Try Info@Dresherlaw.com. That's dresherlaw, D R E S C H E R L A W. com. Like all of us, I'm on my phone constantly. I'm checking emails. You'll reach me. I'll respond. I would love to hear from you. And I'm excited. Now. I'm going to have to do a jam with Mike Chastain.
Richard James: Oh, you definitely have to do a jam with Mike Chastain. There's no question. There's no question. Yeah. He's going to be so happy. He's going to be so happy. You may remember he lives out in Santa Fe, New Mexico now. And he's he's going to a local community college to take some dance courses and music and he gets together, I think he said, like on Sundays and they come over and they craft music together at his house.
ta Fe or what have you, but, [:Atty. Ron Drescher: It should happen.
Richard James: really enjoy that conversation. Yeah, good. Hey, it was a pleasure. Thank you so much.
Thank you. Thank you so much. Congratulations on building a business that you kept it small and kept it all. And congratulations on the new leg of your business and on the ways that you're going to continue to help law firms train their teams to be able to be more efficient, better employees and better workers.
So everybody can find some more joy within their daily work. I appreciate you and what you do for the world that we live in my friend.
Atty. Ron Drescher: Thank you much. And I'll continue to look for you on TikTok.
Richard James: All right.
Atty. Ron Drescher: All right.
